The Poet Creek Express - Foamie Hybrid

[KCStudly]

Thank you Sharon and Terry. It was a little uncomfortable, and not knowing when the power would be back was a little nerve stimulating… I’m not exactly a “prepper”, but it is times like these that show us that it wouldn’t hurt to be a little better prepared.

I had stocked up on some canned goods and pantry items that did not need refrigeration, but we didn’t have as many batteries that we thought we had for some of the flashlights, and I should have put more water up than we had. I was able to get water from the tap for longer than I thought we would due to the pressurized system, and drained from the hot water heater to bucket in order to flush toilets, but I have a couple of 15 gal plastic kegs that I usually fill that I had not gotten to.

There was a half gal of mint chocolate chip ice cream that melted into the bottom drawer of the freezer. Should have put that on the back porch and we could still be eating it.

A little more design time on the hatch struts and I think it is pretty well defined now. Switched to the eyelet ends on top with the under slung brackets at the ribs, and fine-tuned the sketch for the anchor locations based on the slight differences in built up length and the actual bracket offset.

Here are a few screen shots showing a see threw composite with both open and closed superimposed, and shaded models with edges turned on of both closed and opened.




You can also see that I have detailed out the lower anchor plate. I’m still thinking about Bogo’s recommendation to use threaded inserts. At first I thought he meant to use these for the strut ball studs, and I didn’t think they would provide rigid enough support for that cantilevered load, but now I am thinking that they might be a good solution for screwing the wall plate to the wall, if only I can figure out a way to imbed them in the back of the imbedded wall blocking, and then find the holes again after skinning the interior wall.

Maybe if I make the lower strut blocking full 2x through the whole wall thickness, then drill a small pilot hole through the threaded inserts and the inner ply from the outside that could work.

Still haven’t ruled out tying the lower blocks into the wall edging, but that looks like a lot of extra wood that might not be necessary (think airplane not tank).

I’ll lay out the new wall edging scheme tomorrow.

Still need to run the calculations for the strut load ratings and play with the FEA to see if they agree.

Here are some links to some strut force calculations that I found online.
Endine Strut Force Calculation, scroll to top of pg. 4: http://www.enidine.com/pdffiles/Gas_Springs.pdf

Ace controls pg. 4: http://www.acecontrols.com/PDF/Gas%20Spring%20Catalog-Revised%2005-2009.pdf

Bansbach online calculator: http://www.bansbach.de/com/gasfedern/online-calculator-3.html

[KCStudly]

This High Strength Threaded Insert might be a better solution for the strut anchor plates.

I can glue the hard blocking into the foam; skin it; locate the anchor plate; template/transfer the hole locations; drill; install the inserts after the fact; and install the anchor plates.

Thanks Bogo for greasing the skids of my brain.

Seek and ye shall find a solution.

[Wolffarmer]

ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

Why does the forum stop sending me notices of updates????? And with my dad I had not noticed nothing was happening. Now I have to catch up on KC's work.

Randy

[KCStudly]

Sometimes it feels like nothing is happening.
Randy, I hope your dad is doing better... at least holding his own I hope.

How far back have you missed? The big excitement around here was the blizzard, not much actual building going on, but I got a chance to exercise my Coleman stuff.

I seem to be stuck in design mode on the "hatch strut contingency plan", though I think I have that settled now.

That and grinding on about having to redo my galley wall edging. The more time I spend thinking about this detail and trying to work out my next move, the more frustrated and discouraged I get.

The following are examples of the questions that are rattling around in my brain; feel free to answer. What species and schedule of wood should I use? Maybe overlapping arcs of segmented 3/4 thk maple or pine forming a two ply lamination, then router to the template? Buy some more 2x select cedar ($$$) and segment that together with lap joints, then router to template? Same thing using 2x fir? Multiple arcs of 3/4 marine ply rough cut into ribs, laminated together in pairs, then router template to final shape? Is 3/4 marine ply actually 3/4 or is it really 23/32 (sanded… my guess is 23/32)?

If the shape was one continuous radius it would be a lot easier to miter cut segments, but it is not that easy… I have three different radii in my hatch.

I need encouragement. My past history has me grinding to a halt on projects when I hit a major snag, loosing enthusiasm. That can't happen here. Too much time and material invested. Just a little snag; nothing to worry about; think positive; work your way through it. We shall overcome.



I was trying to get everything done on the inside of the street side wall before flipping it over or moving on to the next wall, but maybe I should just move on, get something done on the next wall, and come back to these issues after I have had a chance to stew over it...you know, back burner it.

[Wolffarmer]

I did not miss a whole lot. I cot up on the blizzard stuff. Better you than me.

Then I skipped the hatch support designing stuff. To much detail for me to keep straight.

Dad is still hanging in there. He moved to a closer hospital yesterday. Now only 63 miles away and not 165. And they got him to set up and walk more yesterday than he has in weeks. Still not good, the lungs have just about given up and a whole mess of other things that often happen to 87 yo people.

Take each day as it comes. I will probably take my TD to Washington next week to check on the farm and talk with the renter. It is just north of Pasco, Richland, Kennewick.

Randy

[KCStudly]

Hey, I have been in that neck off the woods! Dad lived in Richland, then in Benton City right across the street from the elementary school, behind the church.

The first off road driving I did in the Ford was up the hill on the other side of the highway from the Benton City exit. I think it was actually a state park of sorts. Basically a big bump with a view.

Sister and I had a couple of nice meals at the bar in town there, friendly service.

There was a leather shop off the highway just before the Benton City exit from Richland that looked interesting. I'm assuming belts, holsters, boots and what not... didn't get a chance to stop in there.

The Atomic Ale Brew Pub in Richland was a treat. We ate there several times during our stay.

Take a couple of pics of the area for me, would you please? Anything with sage brush or scrub would work for me.

[Wolffarmer]

Won't take me long to get a picture of sagebrush and scrub.

Randy

[aggie79]

The following are examples of the questions that are rattling around in my brain; feel free to answer. What species and schedule of wood should I use? Maybe overlapping arcs of segmented 3/4 thk maple or pine forming a two ply lamination, then router to the template? Buy some more 2x select cedar ($$$) and segment that together with lap joints, then router to template? Same thing using 2x fir? Multiple arcs of 3/4 marine ply rough cut into ribs, laminated together in pairs, then router template to final shape? Is 3/4 marine ply actually 3/4 or is it really 23/32 (sanded… my guess is 23/32)?

If the shape was one continuous radius it would be a lot easier to miter cut segments, but it is not that easy… I have three different radii in my hatch.

KC,

If I may, here are a couple of thoughts to get you "over the hump." Regarding how to attach the strut brackets, I would not use threaded inserts. It's not that I'm averse to using them - I've used them in quite a few other woodworking projects and jigs for woodworking - but they're not really necessary. I have a rather long and heavy hatch and the brackets are sufficiently held in place by screws. (On my side wall bracket the screws are perpindicular to the plywood lamination. On my hatch bracket, the screws are parallel with the plywood laminations.) Plus, I think that the relatively close spacing of the inserts for the strut brackets could weaken the anchoring blocks.

Regarding the sidewall radii, I would use plywood if you have a way of matching the thickness. I can't say for marine plywood, but general 3/4" plywood is not 3/4". An option is 3/4" MDO plywood. It is true thickness with one or two MDO facings. Typical this plywood is used for exterior signage so weathering shouldn't be a big concern. If you have a template, I would rough cut the plywood to size, laminate the double thickness that you need (clamping the laminations to a true flat work surface), and then use the template and router to arrive at your desired profile.

Take care and try to stay warm,
Tom

[KCStudly]

Thanks,Tom. I appreciate your input a lot.

I'm aware of MDO, but have never really used it, so I often don't think about it as an alternative to std. ply or true marine ply (I truly am not an experienced wood worker). I'm going to lay out the wall edge ribs in a cut schedule and see how big of a piece I would need to get them all out of, then compare that cost with some of the other methods I mentioned. I'm sure it would be the strongest and most stable option. I guess it doen't really matter because I know I can't get them out of a half sheet any way. With the small size SUV TV I have to jump through a few extra hoops to transport full sheets.

Thanks for the tip on the thread inserts. I was just over thinking/over engineering that one, I'm sure. Precious is the voice of experience. I think I have a few chunks of the Red Grandis left over from the hatch ribs that should be large and hard enough to use for those wall blocks. Or I could probably come up with a chunk or two of oak, or maple; will use a hardwood there for sure.

[atahoekid]

Won't take me long to get a picture of sagebrush and scrub.

Randy

Sounds like Nevada. If it isn't covered in concrete or neon, it's covered in sagebrush...

[ghcoe]

Won't take me long to get a picture of sagebrush and scrub.

Randy

Sounds like Nevada. If it isn't covered in concrete or neon, it's covered in sagebrush...

You can not tell where Idaho ends and Nevada begins.....

[Wolffarmer]

Won't take me long to get a picture of sagebrush and scrub.

Randy

Sounds like Nevada. If it isn't covered in concrete or neon, it's covered in sagebrush...

You can not tell where Idaho ends and Nevada begins.....

You got that right.

Dad is actually doing a lot better. He is in a hospital to home/nursing home program now. He still is mighty weak and really his lungs are about gone. One day at a time. Figure the Japanese Empire had a hard time trying to get rid of him. He did get his ticket home from that. They flew him out of the Philippines to Los Negros then on hospital ship to the states. And he still has shrapnel in him.

Randy

[KCStudly]

Glad to hear a little ray of sunshine, Randy. Am hoping for more of that to come.

Sub freezing temps here; dead dog beat tired from working on structural repairs to 150 year old factory today; no workee on camperee todayee.

[KCStudly]

Not such a hard day at work today (has been hectic the last few days, tho) and it was warmer the last couple of days... in the 30's... so I made some forward progress on TPCE tonight!!! Whoo-hoo!

Dropped back and will simmer on the hydraulic struts vs. linear actuators, and the galley wall edging. Actually, I was able to spring the laminated ones some, so I am wondering if I can get away with pulling them into position, or even putting a tourniquet on them from end to end and retrain them into the proper shape before gluing them in. Simmering on the back burner.

I took a couple of pics of my work tonight, but they don't show much and aren't anything that you did not see on the first wall.

First I flipped the street side wall over and laid out the location of the porch light blocking and the tentative location of the fender blocking. Then I shuffled the pile of parts and swapped the curb side wall up onto the floor/work table.

Got all of the inside wall blocking locations laid out, and that was about it.

Spent a little time sanding the cutting board that I had reglued... seems like weeks ago.

Felt good to be back in the shop.

I do have some "life" issues to contend with in the next couple of weeks, though. On the upside my mom's B-day is this weekend and we usually get together and treat her to a nice dinner. Then on the weekend of the 10th I will be in Arlington for the burial of Yvette's mom's ashes at the national cemetery (because her dad was a WWII veteran with combat service and 30+ years duty in submarines, she gets to be buried with him). And the chunker team is trying to pull together another build day in the near future, too. This weekend I have agreed to work for Karl and help him knock out some great paying fab jobs that all came in at once (how could I say no?... never, plus he's making a wad and will pay me for my time... I'm giving him my "I owe you big time" friends rate).

Progress is progress, so I'm happy.

[KCStudly]

Happy Birthday wishes to my mom!!!